| Welcome to the home of some of the Washington Redskins' most ravenous fans. If this is your first visit, please read our rules and regulations. You must register before you can access all of the forums, and to use all the board's features and options; members also enjoy fewer advertisements. |
| Author |
Message |
DarthMonk DarthMonk

Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 3203
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 10:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Posted at 12:01 PM ET, 03/23/2012 TheWashingtonPost Redskins have yet to sign a right tackle; Jammal Brown encouraged by rehab
By Mike Jones
Quiet in free agency for most of this week, the Washington Redskins have yet to find an answer at right tackle. Meanwhile, the incumbent, Jammal Brown -- who is rehabilitating a hip injury -- is optimistic that this spring he can prove to coaches that he remains the best option at that position.
Tackle Jammal Brown (77) is helped from the field after he sustained an injury during warm-ups before the game against the New England Patriots Dec. 11. (Photo by Jonathan Newton/The Washington Post)The team hosted Buffalo Bills free agent Demetrius Bell last week, but the four-year veteran left Redskins Park without agreeing to terms, and reportedly is drawing interest from the Arizona Cardinals as well.
Other options remain on the market, with San Diego’s Marcus McNeill and the Giants’ Kareem McKenzie also still unsigned. It’s unclear how much interest the Redskins have in them, however.
The right tackle position requires the team’s attention because of the uncertainty that surrounds Brown’s surgically repaired hip. Brown missed all of the 2009 season while recovering from surgery to repair a torn labrum, and has missed seven games over the last two seasons because of lingering problems.
After the 2011 season ended, Coach Mike Shanahan said that Brown needed an entire offseason to rehab and attempt to regain full strength. The coach said the former two-time Pro Bowler’s future with the team would hinge on his ability to recover.
Brown, who has spent the majority of the offseason working with team trainers, said Friday via text message that he is very encouraged by his progress. Brown also said he “most definitely” expects to be fully ready by the time OTAs get underway late this spring.
It remains to be seen whether the Redskins have the same level of optimism about Brown, who is entering the second year of a five-year, $20.25 million contract. This year, he will count for $4.6 million against the salary cap.
The team’s other on-roster options at right tackle could include second-year pro Willie Smith, who played the final four games of the season at left tackle, and four-year veteran Tyler Polumbus, who started four games at right tackle.
If the Redskins don’t succeed in bringing in another veteran, they could draft one. This year’s draft features a number of right tackles expected to be available in the middle rounds. Ole Miss’s Bobby Massie, Cal’s Mitchell Schwartz or Miami’s Brandon Washington are projected to be available in the late-second to mid-third round range, and could be options for the Redsksins, who have the sixth pick of the third round.
DarthMonk |
|
| Back to top |
|
Red_One43 Hog
Joined: 16 Aug 2008 Posts: 4606 Location: D.C.
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 7:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Point-Counterpoint: How much help is needed on O-line?
Rich Tandler:
| Quote: | | This just in–it’s not 2009 any more. This line is not going to make anyone forget the ’91 Hogs or anything but it’s more mediocre than awful. Redskins quarterbacks were sacked 41 times in 2011. That’s four more sacks that the average NFL team allowed, or about one more sack a month. And remember that 10 of those sacks where in one game against the Bills in Toronto when John Beck had so many problems getting rid of the ball it seemed that the it was Super Glued to his hand |
Bill Standig:
| Quote: | | According to Pro Football Focus, the Redskins line ranked 30th against the run, 29th against the pass last season. Should we entrust essentially the same core with guarding a heavily invested in rookie passer? For basic depth purposes, more linemen are needed (this group could not overcome an injury to a non-Pro Bowler like Kory Lichtensteiger). |
Rich Tandler:
| Quote: | | Finally, I love PFF’s work but you did notice which O-line ranked behind the Redskins, right? The Super Bowl champion Giants. |
I agree with both of them. As Tandler says, we are not in dire straits with the O line. I expect the same guys to improve, but as Standig says, we need more depth. Shanny will draft a O lineman or two in the late rounds unless he sees someone he really likes in 3 or 4, and he will work his magic to find another Willie Smith in the undrafted ranks. I don't see him filling up his 7 choices with mostly OL. BPA for Shanny - all the way!
http://www.realredskins.com/rich-tandlers-real-redsk/2012/04/point-counterpoint-how-much-help-is-needed-on-o-line.html |
|
| Back to top |
|
Deadskins JSPB22

Joined: 02 Jul 2004 Posts: 14709 Location: Location, LOCATION!
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 9:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Red_One43 wrote: | Bill Standig:
| Quote: | | According to Pro Football Focus, the Redskins line ranked 30th against the run, 29th against the pass last season. |
|
Well that's the problem right there. They're ranking our offenesive line as a defensive line.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
skinsfan#33 #33

Joined: 24 Jul 2004 Posts: 3875
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 9:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I was hoping that our path to improving our ol depth was by making one or two of our starters, backups.
Don't how people point out our sack totals but fail to mention only two teams ol gave up more qb hits. That isn't exactly the ol I want my franchise qb starting his career behind. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Red_One43 Hog
Joined: 16 Aug 2008 Posts: 4606 Location: D.C.
|
| Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 11:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| skinsfan#33 wrote: | I was hoping that our path to improving our ol depth was by making one or two of our starters, backups.
Don't how people point out our sack totals but fail to mention only two teams ol gave up more qb hits. That isn't exactly the ol I want my franchise qb starting his career behind. |
You also have to remember that getting the ball out quickly is on the receivers and QBs. Failure to do so means more hits on your QB. You have to remember that our O is based on timing. A lot of time, the receiver could not get separation and a lot of time, the QB didn't get the ball out quick enough. You add a few receiver that can stretch the field and a QB that can actually hit them, suddenly a mediocre line looks a little better, instantaneously.
If you add in that continuity is important to an O line especially a ZBS line, then the line has to be better than last year.
Monty - average center - serviceable.
Lichtensteiger - Ol leader - overachiever - Shanny's guy
Chester - Shanny prototype athleticism- supposed to improve
Trent - Shanny prototype athleticism - showed improvement
Brown - ? - but Shanny is optimistic about him getting healthy
Shanny clearly likes what he sees for now with his starters.
Shanny said that we need depth. That is what he is aiming for this year.
Had he had more free agency money, he would have probably signed at least one of the top guards and/or a tackle, but he clearly prioritizes the skill positions first because he believes that he can coach up an O lineman.
I personally would like for Shanny to build the team from the O and D lines, but I have accepted that that is not the way he rolls when building his lines. That is why he needs 5 years to build a team. He likes to add the pieces a few at a time, when the right ones come along. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Link
|
|
 |
Red_One43 Hog
Joined: 16 Aug 2008 Posts: 4606 Location: D.C.
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
I thought that this might be interesting.
How did Shanny, protege, Gary Kubiak, build his OL at Houston?
Kubiak's O line draft Choices:
2006 draft - 3/66 (from New Orleans) Eric Winston Offensive tackle Miami (FL)
2007 - 5/163 (from New Orleans) Brandon Frye Offensive tackle Virginia Tech
6/183 Kasey Studdard Offensive guard Texas
2008 -1/26 (from Baltimore) Duane Brown Offensive tackle Virginia Tech
2009 - 3/77 Antoine Caldwell Center Alabama
2010 - 6/187 Shelley Smith Offensive guard Colorado State
2011- 7/214 Derek Newton Offensive tackle Arkansas State
Became Starters
Eric Winston becomes a starter in 2007
Duane Brown starts as a rookie 2008
Kasey Studdard starter 2009
(Chris Meyers - C - was drafted in the 6th round in 2005 became a starter in 2007)
Mike Brisiel UDFA starter in 2008
Chris White UDFA replaces Brisiel in 2009 during the season. Injury to Brisiel?
Wade Smith drafted by Miami 2003 3rd round 78th pick. Replaces Studdard in 2010 after signing as a free agent. Texans are his 4th team
http://www.nfl.com/player/wadesmith/2505633/profile
Texans 2011 Starters
Myers - 6th round 2005; Starter 2007
Smith - Free Agent 2010(No Big Splash here); Starter 2010
Brisiel - UDFA 2007; Starter 2008
Winston - 3rd round 2006; Starter 2007
Brown - 1st round 2008; Starter 2008 .
Four of the five have started together since 2008.
We know the performance of the Texans ZBS line. Two of them were coveted in FA this year. As you can see, Kubiak built his line like Shanny is doing. It also took time time.
The question for Shanny is do you have the right guys? Kubiak obviously did.
Redskins 2011 Starters
Williams is looks like he is progressing at least until the Dope issue
Brown - health issues the concern -looked like a good trade at the time
Monty - Doubt he will be come a Chris Meyers, but Lock Out and Cap issues didn't help Shanny here.
Kory - Was progressing very well
Chester - Shanny says that he is progressing.
It takes time to build a ZBS line through the draft
Definitely Shanny will be drafting some O linemen in the draft, but again, it doesn't necessarily mean the 3rd round pick. It depends on the BPA in round three.
Last edited by Red_One43 on Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:59 am; edited 2 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
RG3 Fan newbie
Joined: 13 Mar 2012 Posts: 19 Location: Texas
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:18 am Post subject: NFC East OL must be good. |
|
|
| In the NFC EAST the offensive line better be good or the QB is going to look very bad or will get hurt. Hopefully, the current OL will do the job and we can get some good back ups in the draft. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Countertrey the 'mudge

Joined: 09 Jan 2004 Posts: 12767 Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
|
| Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 12:29 pm Post subject: Re: NFC East OL must be good. |
|
|
| RG3 Fan wrote: | | In the NFC EAST the offensive line better be good or the QB is going to look very bad or will get hurt. Hopefully, the current OL will do the job and we can get some good back ups in the draft. |
Again, how much time did Rex the statue lose to injury last year? The line progressed nicely once they got past the injury bug. Look, I'd love to have 5 blue chip linemen, and back-ups who would start on most teams, but that is simply not reality.
RG3 will get plenty of attention early. He will only need to burn teams a couple of times before they step back to a contain first philosophy... that's almost like adding an extra blocker.
There will be steps to address the O-line in the draft... and probably after June 1, when cap cuts take place. I don't think there's any need for anxierty here. |
|
| Back to top |
|
skinsfan#33 #33

Joined: 24 Jul 2004 Posts: 3875
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 12:47 am Post subject: Re: NFC East OL must be good. |
|
|
| Countertrey wrote: |
Again, how much time did Rex the statue lose to injury last year? The line progressed nicely once they got past the injury bug. Look, I'd love to have 5 blue chip linemen, and back-ups who would start on most teams, but that is simply not . |
Look I would like to have a blue chipper at 2 or 3 spots with solid guys st the other 2 or 3 spots! We have maybe one blue chipper (and he is one toke a way from being gone for a year), 2 or 3 solid guys (one had his knee rooted to sheds near mid season and probably won't be ready on opening day), and our last guy has a bad hip that will never be better'
I have more faith in the backups that started at the end of the than I do in some of our starters.
Exactly when did we get over the injury bug last season? Monty and Chester were the only starters starting at the end of the season.
Yes, the QB and WRs did contribute to some the qb hits but you can't expect the horrid performance our ol put out last year wrt qb hits to improve dramatically even with RG3 and one new starting WR (who isn't much better than one of the guys that we had starting!) |
|
| Back to top |
|
KazooSkinsFan kazoo

Joined: 05 Sep 2004 Posts: 10021 Location: Kazmania
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 7:46 am Post subject: Re: NFC East OL must be good. |
|
|
| skinsfan#33 wrote: | | I have more faith in the backups that started at the end of the than I do in some of our starters |
I think that's one reason we haven't signed anyone yet, we had some decent looks at the end of last year. I think the plan is to look at the guys we have, see how Jamaal looks, see if we can get anyone we like in the draft and look at the waiver wire later. If we win the cap case, maybe we get a little more aggressive with signing someone, but obviously not a blue chipper.
I don't think this year it's a case of not caring about the line, I think it's that the guys they looked at for the money it took they didn't see them as a sufficient upgrade. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Link
|
  |
Red_One43 Hog
Joined: 16 Aug 2008 Posts: 4606 Location: D.C.
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 10:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
Skinsfan 33, I can say that I am in agreement with you that the line needs upgrading. The reality is that upgrading would be by the combination of development and continuity (looks like the whole line is back) , getting healthy (Brown and Kory must get healthy) and by depth (Are Hurt and Smith the real deals - Polumbus looked better than a unhealthy Brown). We will most likely pick up a vet tackle like last year hopefully better than Locklear. We will draft some young 'uns but it is a slim chance that one of those guys will be a starter as a rookie unless injuries force the situation. We hopefully will find some more Willie Smiths in the UDFA market, but again, highly unlikely a Day 1 starter. We might have to get a stop gap vet if Kory is not ready.
That looks like the picture for now given the cap situation. No blue chippers are going to added.
Now, here is where I disagree with you wholeheartledly. Last year's O line was not doom and gloom last year. We moved the ball, but we settled for FGs. You focus on "horrid" QB hits? How about "horrid" QB turnovers. Go game by game and you will see that our O line was not Doom and Gloom. Check out the stats in the Arizona game (455 total offensive yds) - why did we only have 22 points in that game and the D had to save it - it wasn't the O line.
About our O:
Timing O - Yes, better QB play with an ability to extend plays reduces sacks and hits. Also recievers getting open. Also having a deep threat.
Running threat QB - Does change your rush tactics - Detmer speaks to this on a post in RG3 2 DC thread
Continuity - does produce better line play
Deep threat opens up the run game. (No more 9 in the box, Philly! C'mon, Skins, you don't think teams stacking the box had something to do with the poor run game of the O line early in the season? How did we rattle off consecutive individual 100 yard games later in the season if the line was so bad?)
Our line was average last year. They need to get better this year, BUT it was not the doom and gloom that you are making it out to be. Check out the game film and how the defenders played us in the beginnning of the season. Once again, compare how our line is being built with the teams across the NFL and you will see that Shanny is doing it the way the majority of teams do it. I posted a thread last summer in "General Manager Office about "Trends Found in Play-off team's Offensive Lines."
http://www.thehogs.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=539891#539891
Last edited by Red_One43 on Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:31 pm; edited 3 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
Countertrey the 'mudge

Joined: 09 Jan 2004 Posts: 12767 Location: Curmudgeon Corner, Maine
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 11:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Absolutely. The gloom and doom about the line is simply blown beyond reasonable proportion. Could it be better? That's a no brainer. Is it good enough to serve? Based on the end of last season, yeah. It is. |
|
| Back to top |
|
rskin72 Hog
Joined: 11 Mar 2012 Posts: 283
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 11:35 am Post subject: Oline |
|
|
While i think our oline needs to add depth, i dont think that the oline was brutal last season. Considering injuries to the line (including Cooley) and the fact that our QB's were lacking in a lot of areas including mobility and accuracy. Also, as others have mentioned, i am sure plans for oline additions have taken a bit of a back seat thanks to Mara's reindeer game ruling.
I look for some oline additions during the draft.....maybe if our $$$ situation gets resolved soon, and in our favor, we will add some fa's. |
|
| Back to top |
|
andyjens89 Hog
Joined: 21 Mar 2004 Posts: 1894 Location: Michigan
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:25 am Post subject: |
|
|
The offensive line wasn't as bad as people think, in my opinion.
Williams - Looked great at times, but still has a LOT of learning and growing to do. Missing 4 games due to a suspension doesn't help either.
Lichtensteiger - Out for the year. Looked decent.
Montgomery - Had to play at guard for a couple of games because of injury.
Chester - The only starter to play all 16 games at one position.
Brown - Still adjusting to the right side and not quite healed from hip surgery. I think he will be a little more healthy and able this year.
Backups:
Smith - Looked pretty good for an undrafted rookie.
Hurt - Wasn't terrible as far as I remember. 7th round rookie.
Also, they were allowing Helu and Royster to bust out for 100 yard games pretty consistently.
You could also blame receivers not being open for some of the problems we had with sacks too. It's not always the pass rush, but the coverage that gets you a sack.
Once you get a quarterback in there who can make plays and read the defense you will fix a lot of problems. |
|
| Back to top |
|
The Hogster #######

Joined: 06 Mar 2005 Posts: 7001 Location: Washington D.C.
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| andyjens89 wrote: | The offensive line wasn't as bad as people think, in my opinion.
Williams - Looked great at times, but still has a LOT of learning and growing to do. Missing 4 games due to a suspension doesn't help either.
Lichtensteiger - Out for the year. Looked decent.
Montgomery - Had to play at guard for a couple of games because of injury.
Chester - The only starter to play all 16 games at one position.
Brown - Still adjusting to the right side and not quite healed from hip surgery. I think he will be a little more healthy and able this year.
Backups:
Smith - Looked pretty good for an undrafted rookie.
Hurt - Wasn't terrible as far as I remember. 7th round rookie.
Also, they were allowing Helu and Royster to bust out for 100 yard games pretty consistently.
You could also blame receivers not being open for some of the problems we had with sacks too. It's not always the pass rush, but the coverage that gets you a sack.
Once you get a quarterback in there who can make plays and read the defense you will fix a lot of problems. |
The line wasn't as bad as it seemed, but we have to address it. Lichtensteiger is already undersized at guard. He's 290lbs. Now coming off of two torn knee ligaments, I don't think we can expect him to be able to play at his former level consistently. We need a LG.
RT - I think Brown will be better this year, as he'll be more healthy. But we need players who we believe are capable of starting.
I'd think we are looking at RT, & OG with 1 or more of our picks in rounds 3-4.
Mitchell Schwartz - Cal
Bobbie Massie - Ole Miss
Zebrie Sanders - FLA State
May be options.
I think Montgomery is one of the better Centers in the game. Top 15. Williams if he can mature is a very good LT. Chester is adequate. We need that depth at OG and T though. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Link
|
|
 |
| Page 4 of 5 | All times are GMT - 5 Hours |
|