Various Preseason Power Rankings

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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby riggofan » Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:10 am

emoses14 wrote:Mike didn't do a good job as HC last year for a bunch of reasons we have no idea of, but they were because of him and his choices. Not Dan's. At least not that I can see, anyway.


I'm sure this has been hashed out in older threads repeatedly, but yeah I'm pretty much in agreement with what you're saying. No doubt Dan Snyder bears most of the responsibility for how bad this franchise has been over the past 20 years. But I've never understood what the big complaint with him during the Shanahan tenure is supposed to be. From what I could see, he gave Shanahan control and stepped out of the way which is what everybody was asking him to do. His big crime was apparently having Thanksgiving dinner with his franchise QB.

Shanahan took on a huge mess of a job that unexpectedly became possibly the worst job in the NFL when we were hit with the cap penalty. I just don't think he wanted to do it anymore especially when it became obvious how bad the season was going to be. He didn't want to deal with the BS and forced his way out.

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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby SkinsJock » Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:26 am

Dan Snyder has repeatedly hurt this franchise in many different ways - when he did it makes no difference to me

AGREED - Mike made him take steps in the right direction but IMO Dan still found a way to interfere and it hurt this club

the good news is that recently Snyder has let the club be managed by others - hopefully that continues

Mike and Kyle are good at what they do but they could have helped Robert to become a better NFL QB - what they did with him was short sighted



I have no idea what you're raving on about with all that other drivel - I did not post anything like that



go kiss Dan's derrière - he loves that stuff and he probably misses having Cerrato around :lol:
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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby emoses14 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:50 am

SJ, at least you're consistent.

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I know he got a pretty good zip on the ball. He has a quick release. . . once I seen a coupla' throws, I was just like 'Yeah, he's that dude.'"

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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby emoses14 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:55 am

To get back on topic, I think anything from mid teens to early 20s is about right in light of the past 2 years, this off season so far and a conservative view of Griffin's abilities. I think if you accept the ESPN rankings formula that put him at 19 amongst QBs (you're an idiot) you could talk yourself into lowering the team below that range (i.e. worse) and if you assume the absolute best of all worlds for him and his play, you could talk yourself into a few spots better.

Otherwise, we'll just have to wait and see.
I know he got a pretty good zip on the ball. He has a quick release. . . once I seen a coupla' throws, I was just like 'Yeah, he's that dude.'"

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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby SkinsJock » Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:14 am

emoses14 wrote: ... Please show me the evidence of Dan leaking the news of Mike wanting to quit after 2012 but not and then Mike being disgruntled with Griffin and where Dan forced Mike to play Griffin until he couldn't stand, literally. Please show me where Dan has exhibited ANY of the signs (aside from general views on the nickname crap) of being the over stepping owner he WAS and that, say, Jerry Jones, is. Please help me, 'cause this crap is about as played out as the Macarena was/is.

Mike didn't do a good job as HC last year for a bunch of reasons we have no idea of, but they were because of him and his choices. Not Dan's. At least not that I can see, anyway.


I will be happy to - BUT

Please show me where I posted that Dan leaked anything ...
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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby riggofan » Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:16 am

emoses14 wrote:Otherwise, we'll just have to wait and see.


We won't have to wait and see much longer! Do you realize our first preseason game is only 22 days away??? :)

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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby SkinsJock » Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:47 am

I predict the Redskins will be much improved over last season - there are still many issues to resolve and not a lot of quality depth
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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby emoses14 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:52 am

riggofan wrote:
emoses14 wrote:Otherwise, we'll just have to wait and see.


We won't have to wait and see much longer! Do you realize our first preseason game is only 22 days away??? :)


Yes, yes I do.
I know he got a pretty good zip on the ball. He has a quick release. . . once I seen a coupla' throws, I was just like 'Yeah, he's that dude.'"

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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby SkinsJock » Wed Jul 16, 2014 1:03 pm

3 weeks tomorrow, against the NE patsies, which means I'll be able to watch the whipping we're going to inflict on Bill's boys ...
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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby crazyhorse1 » Thu Jul 17, 2014 1:22 pm

SkinsJock wrote:Dan Snyder has repeatedly hurt this franchise in many different ways - when he did it makes no difference to me

AGREED - Mike made him take steps in the right direction but IMO Dan still found a way to interfere and it hurt this club

the good news is that recently Snyder has let the club be managed by others - hopefully that continues

Mike and Kyle are good at what they do but they could have helped Robert to become a better NFL QB - what they did with him was short sighted



I have no idea what you're raving on about with all that other drivel - I did not post anything like that



go kiss Dan's derrière - he loves that stuff and he probably misses having Cerrato around :lol:


I'd like for someone to tell me precisely how Dan Snyder has hurt this franchise-- Here's all I see: 1)Made bad decisions in hiring incompetent head coaches and GM's, and then kept them around, 2) Agreed to pay nearly worthless FA's astronomical amounts of money.

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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby HEROHAMO » Thu Jul 17, 2014 11:23 pm

Im brutally honest when I think its a negative and overly optimistic when I think its a positive.

I honestly think that our offense can shoot to top five. Rushing offense can be tops and probably could be one of the more balanced offenses in the league. So how high would you guys rate a top offensive team with a terrible defense?

Hmmmm.... Personally I think since our division is so watered down. We are going to make the playoffs again. Our additions on defense also give me confidence.

So I think we are the tenth most dangerous team in the league. This is all speculation anyways. Even though we deserve to be second worst ranked team. We did have the second worst record in the league last year.

Given RG3s spectacular rookie season. We all seen the potential Bob has. Now add to that one of the leagues best rushing attacks with Alf a rising young talent at tight end, a proven threat in Garcon and a new weapon in Djax? Wow this looks promising.

Our Oline which was a weakness last year is a question mark. But I too believe that our draft addressed these issues.

We added some nice solid free agents to shore up the defense for the short term. Ryan Clark, Jason Hatcher and that other corner I forgot his name who made the pick six on Manning in the SB for the Saints.

We dont need our defense to be top five. But we do need our defense to be at least top fifteen for us to have a shot at the Lombardi.

We have to remember that for the most part we will probably have to beat one of these teams in the playoffs 49ers, Seahawks , Panthers, Saints and some other teams. Those three I mentioned are stacked on both sides of the ball. We are going to need our defense to at least be able to get us some stops or its going to be brutal.
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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby SkinsJock » Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:08 am

I'm normally optimistic but I just think the team needs time to get the depth issue resolved ...

we do have talent at the skill positions on offense and RG3 will show that he's a really good QB when used and prepared properly

I believe Mike wanted Haslett to be conservative and I think that we'll see a more attacking defense

however, we're going to need time to overcome the lack of quality depth
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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby riggofan » Fri Jul 18, 2014 12:57 pm

Enjoyed your post, man! Lots of good stuff in here.

HEROHAMO wrote:I honestly think that our offense can shoot to top five. Rushing offense can be tops and probably could be one of the more balanced offenses in the league. So how high would you guys rate a top offensive team with a terrible defense?

Hmmmm.... Personally I think since our division is so watered down. We are going to make the playoffs again. Our additions on defense also give me confidence.


Totally agree about the division. I think its the thing that everybody completely overlooks talking about this team. Some 9-7 team from the NFC East will go to the playoffs. The big question to me is are the Eagles legit or not? If they're as good or better than they were last year, I think it will be tough to win the division.

As to your question about top offense/terrible defense, I feel good that our defense will be considerably better than last year. If we can be a top offense, like you say, that alone will help the D tremendously. Quit turning the ball over and putting the D in a bad spot. Quit going three and out over and over. How about special teams? Quit spotting teams the ball at the 45 yard line. lol. I don't know if we'll be a top 15 defense even, but just being mediocre would be an improvement over being terrible!

HEROHAMO wrote:Our Oline which was a weakness last year is a question mark. But I too believe that our draft addressed these issues.


Definitely a question mark. I like both of those o-line picks but I'm not sure the draft addressed the issues in the short term. We might have to wait a while on Long and Moses to contribute.

I would be really happy to see one of the younger guys win a starting job this summer. If we're starting Williams/Lauvao/Kory/Chester/Polumbus in week one, I'll definitely be nervous.

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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby HEROHAMO » Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:17 am

Thanks Riggo,
The Pukes really didnt help themselves in the off season I believe. I mean they already had a bad defense. Then they get rid of Ware and Sean Lee there best young defender tears his ACL. I just cant see how the Pukes are going to compete. Only way I can see is if Dez and Tony Ohno have a career day. So I got to think if we double Dez and stuff the run against them we should be able to blow them out.

Philly lost their best receiver to us. They also happened to have a bad defense. But on offense they are similar to us. They have a young QB who has a cannon. They have a nasty rb in Mccoy but he is not as durable as our rb Alf. Ill admit its still tough to stop the Eagles offense. Mccoy alone can be a nightmare. So pretty much if our defense does improve we should win these games against them. If our defense does not improve then its going to be a shootout. Or we can try clock management and drain the clock with Alf and RG3 playaction. But our defense should just focus on stopping Mccoy and we should win against the Iggles.

The Gstrings are a big question mark to me. They looked absolutley aweful last year. But so did we. Half the players on defense from the SB winning roster are now gone. Bunch of new players on defense. On offense its much the same. I have no idea who the starting RB for NY will be. The WRs I dont know who they are either. The fact that the Giants have relatively new players should work in our favor. But you never know. Oh yeah they have Cruz and Manning. Basically if they still have issues at RB then all we have to do is focus on stopping Cruz and getting to Sheli. That should be enough to win against NY.

Out of all the teams I believe we are in the best shape. We are just one year removed from winning the division. We signed many free agents on the defensive side. Also returning a solid starter on the DLine. On paper I think we are the tenth most dangerous team.

Thing about RG3 is he has this ridiculous work ethic. I mean Ive never heard any teammates talk so much about another teammates work ethic. RG3 was running sprints in the hotel parking lot in a story I heard when everyone else was there to enjoy the nightlife.
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Re: Various Preseason Power Rankings

Postby FanofallthatisGibbs » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:22 am

The comparisons between 2012 and 2013 O-line are funny to me. They were essentially the same in both years, the difference being the play of RGIII. The O-line was built as a fast, agile run-based line, not a steadfast iron wall built for pass protection. It will take years to transition away from this more college spread offense/zone read type of line to a traditional NFL line. It worked perfectly in 2012 because of the movement of RGIII in and out of the pocket + option threats. Defenders didn't know whether to rush the QB or stay back and hold the line - either way they got burned. In 2013, they smelled blood and it got ugly - QBs and RBs got rocked. This affected the run game equally as holes closed up in a hurry without an option threat from RGIII. The blame for this lies squarely with the coaches who forced RGIII back prematurely (I don't give a rat's ass what Dr. Andrews says!) and had no "Plan B" with Cousins.

So 2014 and beyond? This will be a very telling season for the future of the franchise. I believe RGIII's two injuries (one in college + 2012 playoffs) have now made him subconsciously scared to run the ball. Media certainly can't help his psyche. He has never been able to slide. What is great to hear is not his speed running down the field like everyone focused on last year in preseason to prove his knee had healed, but that his mechanics are improved for throwing in the pocket. But this positive development has a negative if taken for granted:

With no legs, RGIII is a one-hit trick with his arm. The offensive scheme needs to open up the primary receiver in a particular play for him for a fast release. If it's not there, he needs to quickly make 3-5 yards out of a broken play, with an occasional busted play that nets 20+ yards on a keeper. This keeps the chains moving, takes pressure off the o-line (keeping RGIII off his back), and also loosens up the defense. Trying to make him a traditional pocket passer is like trying to take your sports car and turn it into a truck. Different chasis, different engine, different function and style. Yet in the NFL, running an offense like this is a ticking time bomb waiting to go off (see playoffs 2012).

This team has an identity problem because the RGIII injury in 2012 fundamentally changed the team. 2013 was like watching a burning building or a pile up accident on the side of the road - you just couldn't look away no matter how bad it got. So for me, I care less about the O-line (did I just really write that?!), we have what we have to work with there. But these questions remain:
1. Can RGIII play like himself? If so, there is hope for a playoff-bound team. If he tries to be someone he is not, the Skins are doomed from the start. Expect no better than 6 wins.
2. Can Jay Gruden give this team a new identity? We're not talking team name changes, we are talking about focus, unity and accountability on and off the field. I'll hold back from judgement until the year is up. Team chemistry does not happen overnight, though it needs to in this 21st century NFL.
3. Chicken or the Egg? That is - to blitz or not to blitz? Can the defense find balance to keep offenses from blowing up with big plays, and will they tackle this year on first contact? The D and O feed each other. Neither is so strong that it can withstand the other being weak.

If the answers to those above questions are "no" - then once again, the Redskins have years of re-tooling to figure it all out again on how to become a competitive threat in the NFL. Sorry for the negativity, it's just my dose of reality that has sunk in over a long offseason following such a calamity of a season last year. I'd love to be proven wrong, so please - everyone from Snyder to the practice squad - prove me wrong!

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