Redskins/Cowboys file grievance against NFL

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Postby chiefhog44 » Mon Mar 26, 2012 8:35 pm

1niksder wrote:NFL owners by hand vote this morning affirmed salary cap sanctions on Redskins and ttiT, who were not in room.


I listened to Goodell this afternoon and he confirmed that there had been no vote on it at that time and that he was not in the position to discuss what was said. Not sure this has taken place yet.
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Postby 1niksder » Mon Mar 26, 2012 10:58 pm

Cowboys, Redskins must think they can win

If the Cowboys and the Redskins filed their grievance against the league and the NFLPA just for show -- just to make it look to their fans and the rest of the general public as if they're fighting back -- then they'd be out in front of this, barking about it as loudly as they wanted to bark. Instead, they're keeping quiet, in spite of ample opportunity to respond, as they prepare to make their case in front of an arbitrator.

That's the way you act if you have confidence that you're right and can win, as the Cowboys and Redskins do and should. The penalties came from the NFL Management Council -- a group headed by Mara and determined to act in what it believes is the best interest of the league. The NFL's owners decided, among themselves and in the absence of consultation with the players, to attempt to restrict spending during a 2010 season that did not have a salary cap. They are angry at the Redskins and Cowboys for not going along with that.

But arbitrator Stephen Burbank isn't going to be beholden to what Mara and the majority of the NFL's owners believe is in their best interest. He's most likely to rule in favor of common sense. And common sense is on the side of the Cowboys and Redskins here.

If this penalty was rooted in common sense, the NFL's owners would be mad at teams like the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, who spent well below the level where the salary floor would have been. If this were really an issue of future competitive balance, as the ruling establishing the punishments claims it is, then teams that didn't spend enough in 2010 would be punished as well. But the fact that they're only going after the two teams that overspent in 2010 -- or restructured contracts to take short-term hits in an effort to allow them to spend more down the road -- indicates that this is not a competitive balance issue. It's a salary restriction issue.

The NFL's owners don't care as much about competitive balance as they do about keeping player salaries at as reasonable a level as possible. Every team in the league could have behaved exactly as the Cowboys and Redskins did in 2010, but they'd all agreed not to. There was no rule prohibiting them from doing so -- they just all agreed. It was a sketchy arrangement that I'm frankly surprised Mara is so aggressively willing to defend. And the fact that he's the one talking freely about this while the Cowboys and Redskins are keeping mum indicates to me that they know they're right, and he knows he's wrong, and that everybody knows the ultimate decision might end up reflecting just that.
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Postby Kilmer72 » Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:13 pm


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Postby Countertrey » Tue Mar 27, 2012 5:58 am

The more I see... the more I'm thinking there could be penalties to the league. The Redskins, and the Cowboys, were injured... and, it appears there was malice involved...
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Postby The Hogster » Tue Mar 27, 2012 6:42 am

Countertrey wrote:The more I see... the more I'm thinking there could be penalties to the league. The Redskins, and the Cowboys, were injured... and, it appears there was malice involved...


I agree. The tough part would be ascertaining what remedy is appropriate. Since we can't cancel all of the FA contracts that have been signed, and re-open Free Agency. I would propose that the Skins and Cowboys be awarded Compensatory draft picks to compensate for the injury.

A $36M penalty with $18M due this year to me would equal at least a 2nd round pick this year--more like a 1st. We either missed out on at least 1 big free agent or 2-3 mid-tier veterans.

If I'm Burbank, I overturn this penalty. Give the Skins their cap space back, and award them a compensatory 1st round pick. 33rd overall.

The Cowboys should be due a 4th due to the relatively small hit they took. But, nobody cares about them.
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Postby die cowboys die » Tue Mar 27, 2012 7:00 am

The Hogster wrote:
Countertrey wrote:The more I see... the more I'm thinking there could be penalties to the league. The Redskins, and the Cowboys, were injured... and, it appears there was malice involved...


I agree. The tough part would be ascertaining what remedy is appropriate. Since we can't cancel all of the FA contracts that have been signed, and re-open Free Agency. I would propose that the Skins and Cowboys be awarded Compensatory draft picks to compensate for the injury.

A $36M penalty with $18M due this year to me would equal at least a 2nd round pick this year--more like a 1st. We either missed out on at least 1 big free agent or 2-3 mid-tier veterans.

If I'm Burbank, I overturn this penalty. Give the Skins their cap space back, and award them a compensatory 1st round pick. 33rd overall.

The Cowboys should be due a 4th due to the relatively small hit they took. But, nobody cares about them.


+1

but maybe a 3rd rounder for Dallas

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Postby riggofan » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:52 am

Man this was such a good piece of writing on Rich Tandler's blog. Well worth reading the entire piece:

http://www.realredskins.com/rich-tandle ... ement.html

Let’s start with “the NFL’s recent agreement with the NFL Players Association.” Exactly who in the NFL and in the Players Association agreed to this is unclear. We know that the full ownership of the NFL did not take a vote on it. It has been reported that the NFL Executive Committee, headed by Giants owner John Mara, a prime beneficiary of the penalties against Dallas and Washington, negotiated the sanctions with the union. But Jerry Jones is a member of that committee and he knew nothing about it.


The NFL (rather, whatever part of the NFL is in charge of this fiasco) continues to ignore the fact that teams like the Bucs, Chiefs, Jaguars, and Cardinals took advantage of the uncapped year, which did not have a spending floor either, to spend under $100 million on players salaries. This affected competitive balance more than the Redskins and Cowboys overspending did (if “overspending” is indeed possible in a uncapped year). Whatever the issue is here, whatever reason the decision to slap the penalty on the Redskins and Cowboys, competitive balance is not it.

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Postby KazooSkinsFan » Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:11 am

The Hogster wrote:
Countertrey wrote:The more I see... the more I'm thinking there could be penalties to the league. The Redskins, and the Cowboys, were injured... and, it appears there was malice involved...


I agree. The tough part would be ascertaining what remedy is appropriate


You never know what they will rule though. I'll be happy if the cap is just restored. He could rule that even if no rule was broken they had the power to do it.
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Postby SkinsJock » Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:38 am

KazooSkinsFan wrote:
Countertrey wrote:The more I see... the more I'm thinking there could be penalties to the league. The Redskins, and the Cowboys, were injured... and, it appears there was malice involved...

You never know what they will rule though.
I'll be happy if the cap is just restored.
He could rule that even if no rule was broken they had the power to do it.


Kaz - let me understand this - in one sentence you refer to 'they' and in another to 'he'
I think you mean the NFL as 'they' and the arbitrator as 'he'?

Trey - I agree with Kaz - hopefully the arbitrator restores the cap space - I very much doubt that he penalizes other teams
although I'd love it if he'd rub Mara the wrong way :wink:
We are very fortunate to have Kirk Cousins but Griffin has a huge upside IMO

Robert needs to continue to get better and to do that he needs time on the field - hopefully sooner than later

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Postby KazooSkinsFan » Tue Mar 27, 2012 11:47 am

SkinsJock wrote:Kaz - let me understand this - in one sentence you refer to 'they' and in another to 'he'
I think you mean the NFL as 'they' and the arbitrator as 'he'?


"They" was a general reference to arbitrators/judges/juries/...

"He" was the guy assigned in this case.
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Postby Countertrey » Tue Mar 27, 2012 11:51 am

If he does not penalize the league, it will most likely be because he has no authority to do so... we don't know the scope of his charter with the league.

Mara was acting as an agent of the league, the action was validated by the commisioner, and given the force of rule, resulting in injury to two of it's member teams.

It is also clear that Mara directly benefited from this ruling, and that other teams have directly benefited from this ruling, as the amount of the penalty has been added to their salary cap... Many have negotiated with this additional cap in hand, as a tool to sign free agents... this qualifies them as benefactors, as well.

There is evidence of conspiracy, as Jerry Jones, a member of the committe responsible for this was not notified of this action... suggesting nefarious motivation. The timing was designed to inflict maximum injury, with no opportunity for appeal before injury occured.

There's plenty of evidence that a punitive response toward the league is warranted... we don't know that it is within the scope of the arbitors authority to do so.

The league has a huge problem... No matter the outcome, expect the busy bodies from the Senate to want to know "who put Machiavelli in charge of the NFL?" ...
Last edited by Countertrey on Tue Mar 27, 2012 11:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby SkinsJock » Tue Mar 27, 2012 11:52 am

Thanks for clarifying - unlike some posts from you, this makes a lot of sense :lol:

I agree - I also think that the pukes and the Skins are handling this in a way that gives them the only chance of reversing this BS deal by the NFL
We are very fortunate to have Kirk Cousins but Griffin has a huge upside IMO

Robert needs to continue to get better and to do that he needs time on the field - hopefully sooner than later

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Postby Deadskins » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:17 pm

Countertrey wrote:There's plenty of evidence that a punitive response toward the league is warranted... we don't know that it is within the scope of the arbitors authority to do so.

I think we do, and it is.

Under the labor deal, the burden of proof would be on the team that initiaties the complaint. The arbitrator can award damages or provide injunctive relief, and his decision can be appealed to an appeals panel.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/foo ... _blog.html
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Postby Countertrey » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:21 pm

Deadskins wrote:
Countertrey wrote:There's plenty of evidence that a punitive response toward the league is warranted... we don't know that it is within the scope of the arbitors authority to do so.

I think we do, and it is.

Under the labor deal, the burden of proof would be on the team that initiaties the complaint. The arbitrator can award damages or provide injunctive relief, and his decision can be appealed to an appeals panel.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/foo ... _blog.html


Excellent! How about the 32nd pick in April... the Giants get the 33rd :twisted:
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Postby The Hogster » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:22 pm

Countertrey wrote:If he does not penalize the league, it will most likely be because he has no authority to do so... we don't know the scope of his charter with the league.

Mara was acting as an agent of the league, the action was validated by the commisioner, and given the force of rule, resulting in injury to two of it's member teams.

It is also clear that Mara directly benefited from this ruling, and that other teams have directly benefited from this ruling, as the amount of the penalty has been added to their salary cap... Many have negotiated with this additional cap in hand, as a tool to sign free agents... this qualifies them as benefactors, as well.

There is evidence of conspiracy, as Jerry Jones, a member of the committe responsible for this was not n[color=orange]otified of this action... suggesting nefarious motivation. The timing was designed to inflict maximum injury, with no opportunity for appeal before injury occured. [/color]

There's plenty of evidence that a punitive response toward the league is warranted... we don't know that it is within the scope of the arbitors authority to do so.

The league has a huge problem... No matter the outcome, expect the busy bodies from the Senate to want to know "who put Machiavelli in charge of the NFL?" ...


+1

Especially the highlighted points. I can't wait to learn when this goes before the arbitrator.
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